I can't believe there's no "GMC Engine Options?" thread LOL

JBurt

Member
Oct 7, 2019
57
18
8
Fresno. CA.
What's the difference between an Olds Toronado engine and tranny and the GMC? There seems to be no shortage of running Toro's for sale out there.
Toronado 455 - Off the top of my head, there are a number of differences.
Eng: Cam, intake manifold, carb, distr (timing curve), exhaust manfolds.
Trans: numerous internal changes to beef it up. You can check with Manny for details.

Nothing that can't be replaced but they are not just drop-ins and get the same performance.
 

Mike Perez

Active member
Oct 2, 2019
484
123
43
BTW .... the newest Fiat Ducato TurboDiesel, gets stronger crankshaft and bearings, starting with the 160 HP and 180 HP engines, almost 400 Nm of Torx and > 400 Nm for the 180 HP two stage TurboDiesels, and available with the all new ZF, 9-Speed Automatic transmission, much better then the till now used 6 speed robotic auto transmission.

as I hear, ProMaster, which base in fact by FCA was based on the Fiat Ducato, only does offer 6 cylinder gas engines ...
in my opinion the old 150 and 180 HP TurboDiesels with 6-Speed Stickshift already would not have a problem with the weight of the GMC, the newer ones even less ...

ok ..l much towing would be a problem perhaps, but ... all is possible.

bye Daniel
I wonder if that ZF 9 speed is ever going to make its way into the US.
 

Daniel

New member
Oct 9, 2019
11
12
3
Landgraaf, the Netherlands
Mike,
... all road testers with this new ZF Transmission were very impressed by the smooth and powerful way the automatic transmission performed .... but to be honest ... I didn’t expect less from ZF ...


Info about 9 Speed ZF auto transmission Fiat Ducato

BTW ALKO and Fiat also actively working on a hybride MH, front wheel drive Diesel engine, on the back electric drive from ALKO developed....


I wonder if that ZF 9 speed is ever going to make its way into the US.
 

6cuda6

Active member
Oct 3, 2019
478
127
43
53
Ontario, Canada
Lots of ZF transaxles under Volkswagen Passats including the W8....now that would be a swap.....big power from that motor.

The bottom line is you could make anything work but its the longevity......sure the current setup is antiquated but its was built when fuel economy wasnt mandated at 35mpg like today requiring things to be engineered on the edge of failure.

You could take a 455 and push it to big power....for what...you'll just spin the tires off the thing (aka JimK's twin turbo).

You want to go out to the fringe? Electric with e-drive hubs at all wheels.....so 6 wheel drive in the current config with a operating range of 300 miles or so.....or as i said before hydrogen fuel cell electric.....sheesh you could even cheat and go direct drive to the diff instead of drive hubs and not really change to much.
 

pvfjr

Active member
Oct 3, 2019
286
79
28
36
Aumsville OR
Or, you can contact Dave Lenzi and ask if he can build you up an 8.1. He has to make special oil pans and rework the RFB (rear face of block) to make it work. This is not a cheap update.
Matt
Wait, someone made a 496 fit? I like 496s... Have one in our pickup. 😁 It gets mileage as bad as our motorhome driving empty, and that's with a 5-speed! Oh, but the torque and the rumble... Worth it.

Is there a build thread for that somewhere?
What I'd really like to see is someone outfitting an Allison with a chain and final drive. That'd be trick.
 

Matt Colie

Active member
Oct 25, 2019
382
95
28
South East Michigan near DTW
No, there is no build thread anywhere. Dave does not have the time in his life to manage doing that much extra work. Be aware that he is a true wizard. He has owned a GMC for a long time, and when I sees a part that could have been better, he makes it better. That is why so many of us have Lenzi knuckles. Many of us are try to find out what the service life of his front bearings are, but so far 100k plus is very solid.
I did mention that he has to remake the oil pan to pass the right drive axle, and modify the RFB to pull this off, and that is just to get the engine in the frame.
Matt
 

Mike Perez

Active member
Oct 2, 2019
484
123
43
No, there is no build thread anywhere. Dave does not have the time in his life to manage doing that much extra work. Be aware that he is a true wizard. He has owned a GMC for a long time, and when I sees a part that could have been better, he makes it better. That is why so many of us have Lenzi knuckles. Many of us are try to find out what the service life of his front bearings are, but so far 100k plus is very solid.
I did mention that he has to remake the oil pan to pass the right drive axle, and modify the RFB to pull this off, and that is just to get the engine in the frame.
Matt
The 8.1L is cool but with a few tricks you can build an Olds, either 455 or a stroked 495 that has all the coil near plug ignition, port injection, etc...that the Chevy has without the adapter plate. I don't know if it would more or less work and/or expense.
 

RF_Burns

Member
Oct 3, 2019
87
31
18
Ontario Canada
Here is an engine that was FAA approved and flew in a small aircraft for about 2,000hrs of testing. 650ft-lbs of torque @ 1600 RPM and 200HP @ 2,000RPM and about 1/2 the size and weight of a big block V8.
About 40 engines were built then the company was bought by another company who redesigned the whole thing and then dropped it. So you might be able to buy the whole shooting match for a song. Websites are gone but you can find them on a web-archive site.

Press "performance" below for a link to the archived website.

 

Mike Perez

Active member
Oct 2, 2019
484
123
43
Here is an engine that was FAA approved and flew in a small aircraft for about 2,000hrs of testing. 650ft-lbs of torque @ 1600 RPM and 200HP @ 2,000RPM and about 1/2 the size and weight of a big block V8.
About 40 engines were built then the company was bought by another company who redesigned the whole thing and then dropped it. So you might be able to buy the whole shooting match for a song. Websites are gone but you can find them on a web-archive site.

Press "performance" below for a link to the archived website.

Piston aircraft engines won't rev above 2700 RPM's typically. Also they are typically air cooled. They always have adequate airflow because even while stationary on the ground, the propeller provides airflow.
 

Matt Colie

Active member
Oct 25, 2019
382
95
28
South East Michigan near DTW
Piston aircraft engines won't rev above 2700 RPM's typically. Also they are typically air cooled. They always have adequate airflow because even while stationary on the ground, the propeller provides airflow.
This engine is liquid cooled and while it was designed with a low RevCs for aircraft, it is not far off what I see with the stoke 3.07.
I suspect that adaption might be a bear.

Matt
 

RF_Burns

Member
Oct 3, 2019
87
31
18
Ontario Canada
Piston aircraft engines won't rev above 2700 RPM's typically. Also they are typically air cooled. They always have adequate airflow because even while stationary on the ground, the propeller provides airflow.
This engine is liquid cooled and proposed for use in vehicle applications as well. They had one installed in a boat for testing as well. I'm not sure why they went through the FAA approval process when testing in a vehicle would have been much easier.

Anyway, I got interested in "swish-plate" engines a long time ago. The possibility for easy variable displacement was intriguing.

These guys had a number of test engines, some with a couple thousand hours of run time with no failure. Must have run out of money, but the new company added ceramic cylinder linings etc, then just seemed to lose interest.

Just thought it was interesting.
 

tmsnyder

Active member
Oct 7, 2019
485
104
43
Buffalo NY
I'd like to see someone transplant a Promaster engine and transmission into a GMC motorhome. That's the only sort-of-heavy duty FWD drivetrain out there. Marginal longevity, probably. But parts availability, yes. Maybe a tranny builder will come up with a better built version of it though. Until then though, maximizing the tranny cooler size, installing a good set of tranny temp gauges (and watching them carefully) and frequent fluid/filter changes might get you down the road a long way with that setup, who knows?! That's only _if it would fit_. b/c the engine would have to go in transverse instead of longitudinal, I don't know if it will physically fit into the space available.
 

tmsnyder

Active member
Oct 7, 2019
485
104
43
Buffalo NY
Looks like no direct connection between the front ic engine and the rear electric drive except by ground contact? So it charges either by plug in or by 'braking' while driving with the ic engine?